Alternate stats

As mentioned in the last post about stats, the relationship stats would currently be:



As people have pointed out, disgust is the one stat that may be replaceable, since 0 appeal could be said to be disgust. While there are advantages to having disgust in terms of readability and context, there might be better options. Some examples might be,


Aggression seems like it might be the most useful to see visually since it would tell the player how close an enemy is to engaging in combat. Being around someone that doesn't like you, entering their home, stealing their stuff, hitting them, etc, would all probably raise aggression.

Can anybody think of an alternative to disgust that would have more of an impact, mechanically?
Keeping in mind that some thing like malice might be more suited to an individual stat (for example a bandit being more likely to do bad things to everyone.)


  1. Perhaps Loathing is a better term than disgust. Virtually same idea, just a better looking word with a more expressive context.

    1. That's what the low end of hate/love would be, when the overall relationship is bad for a long time.

      Most of the relationship stats like appeal/lust are more volatile short term, whereas love/hate is longterm.

  2. I'd expect love/hate (hate in particular) to determine how much misery an NPC wants to inflict upon you, relationship-wise. You also have attraction/disgust and fear as more temporary modifiers. Do you need another relationship stat?

    Perhaps you could count love/hate separately. Maybe split it up into love (affected by good H) and like/hate (affected by other interactions).
    Love increases long-term desire for H and closeness (as if it was extra attraction basically), and maybe adds some strange behaviour if you're also hated.
    Like/hate determines how much they enjoy your company in general. That way you can have friends without them wanting to bang you and bitter enemies that do.

    Rising temporary aggression could be expressed by shouting, tiny (but extremely threatening) jumps, that anime forehead vein thing and such.

    Malice sounds good, but as a personality stat or trait with different levels rather than a relationship stat. Perhaps even include the opposite, a "good" trait where an NPC would be more likely to help a stranger in trouble.
    Kinda like how in Kenshi random passer-bys may or may not decide to bandage you after you get your ass kicked into unconsciousness. Or they might steal your food and enslave you.

    1. Hating someone doesn't mean you want to kill them. Likewise, a bandit or monster that is usually aggressive doesn't hate everyone, aggression is just a part of their strategy or how they survive (Like if an unintelligent monster tries to defeat and impregnate everything they see for reproduction).

    2. Depends on how deep the hate goes.

      But yes, that's what I thought malice and aggression would imply. An "evil" creature would do you harm without much provocation (low aggression), but if it likes you then maybe it'll leave you alone. Vice-versa for "good".
      Aggression is usually shown to the player visually or audibly, despite being just a number. An NPC warning you when it's about to attack you, whether it's an enemy or a neutral NPC that you stole from.

      I suppose you could include it as a visible stat. Appeal/disgust would be "social" dislike toward a creature, while aggression/temper would be a more "violent" dislike toward it. You can easily factor in aggression into interaction success/failure. If you stole from someone they'd be more likely to refuse your gifts or whatever, but they wouldn't attack you outright unless aggression was really high. And malicious creatures would have bonus aggression from the get go.

      NPC behaviour in general might be good to implement as a separate set of traits.
      "Thief" makes a creature steal, "Kidnapper" makes it abduct victims, "Malicious" makes it act like an ass in general, "Animal" makes it territorial and unable to speak, "Breeder" makes it want to impregnate everything, "Nice" makes it charitable, "Violent" makes it act much more aggressively etc.
      That way you can have AI and relationship modifiers independent of creature type/species.

    3. there could be a meanness stat meaning it wants to do mean things to you like pranks and teasing on the low end building up to rape or bdsm on the high end even if it has a good affection towards you or other enteties and on the directly opposite direction
      niceness that would lead to positive behavior even on a bad relationship

  3. Yeah, either Hostility/Aggression would probably be the best replacement for Disgust. Malice/Malicious would probably be a Trait, meaning an entity with it would have Hostility/Aggression higher than others.

    Also a side note: Maybe distinguishing some learnable Traits/Attributes by calling them Talents would be something to take into consideration. For example, a creature may be Shy by nature, but it takes skill and practice to be an Elegant Combatant.

  4. Mamono Assault Force12 May 2020 at 18:32

    I'm in the camp that says Hostility is a good defining term, as a term that signifies how much they're getting ready to go fight that other party, and then start building that Hate stat for their long lasting relationship.

    Which also means Appeal can stay as it is or be swapped itself to Friendliness. Allowing for two groups that may hate each other a bit but be in a (perhaps temporary) alliance.

  5. How about just a "temper" stat? Essentially it's just the same thing as aggression/hostility with a different feeling. You'll see when an anemy is pissed off or not.

    Breaking free from dominant attempts could raise it, as well as being hit or being knocked down. Maybe you could even have a unique base multiplier to make it so some types of entities gain a temper quicker than others?

    1. I suppose a good word for it would be temperament. If
      0 = docile.
      100 = aggressive.

    2. That's a good way to go. Maybe in the future we'll have items that act as "calm incense" (make creatures in area of effect more docile so you can cross the zone, unlike "sleeping gaz" they're still awake so a bigger danger can still trigger them defending themselves, buying you time) or as opposite..."berzerk incense" creating a chaotic mess of everyone starting to fight eachothers while you're watching from a distance...A bit like when you make someone kick a log that then hit another creature. xD

  6. I still like the idea of having simultaneous high level disgust and appeal.

    1. I like the context it brings (like disgusting monster but high appeal cause they have a big dick or are charismatic)

      However I think the question is what would be mechanically different about having it, and what traits could exist that utilize it in an interesting way. For example if a trait is "Lust increases as disgust increases", then it could still be "if appeal is low", and 0 appeal could be disgust.

      I think the only difference would be if 0 appeal means the enemy does not want to interact with you, but 100 disgust may make them actively insult you. (Or maybe 100 disgust also incites violence, like villagers being disgusted by monsters and thinking they must be destroyed.) Though question is still why that cant just happen at 0 appeal.

    2. All of that is a matter of defining your thresolds.
      "-100 0 100" can easely be converted as "0 50 100" even if it gives way smaller margins to plan around. A 0 appeal as neutral would be moved to 50 of the new balance, the new 0 being 100 disgust or -100 appeal.

      If you don't want to go in negatives, a trick is to to multiply the limits by 2, and divide them by 2 in display. You get a variable working on 200p (0 disgust, 100 neutral, 200 love) in the background, with the same margin as if you used the two 100p stats, but that still is displayed like a single 100p variable in-game.

      It's the same trick than for virtually hard to achieve traits. Makes one need 500p, divide by 5 in display, and you get a normal percentage that fills 5 times slower than a 100p treshold.

    3. The question isnt really if 0 appeal could be disgust, the question is if disgust should be separate, and if having both adds functionality. (aka, if 100 disgust and 100 appeal at the same time causes different behavior)

  7. Perhaps something like respect?
    Could be something tied to how good of a fighter you are and also effect things like an enemies dom/sub state.
    Like if an enemy just thinks you've been a really good fighter, they become more submissive out of respect but this doesn't necessarily mean they'll stop fighting you.
    Or high respect might even mean you earn a following if other conditions are met.
    On the opposite end, low respect just means that everything they decide to do on the subject of the player has no concern for anything else. You likely wont raise love/hate very high and are treated more as something useless if you've just been that bad in battles.
    I think there's a ton more examples I could point out as well.

    1. I'd say that overlaps with fear a bit, especially the first example.

      Could rebrand fear as some sort of "thinks you're strong" stat (respect?), which when combined with high hate or aggression would cause fearful behaviour.

    2. The first example is just one example, but the idea is that it'd be a stat that interacts with the other stats which is why it "overlaps" a little. Now I only thought of it on the fly so it's bound to need thinking through some more but another example is high respect could mean that those entities might even leave food for you when you're close. On the opposite end, an entity with low respect might actually straight up take food right in front of you on purpose. If that entity had high fear but low respect, it could be possible they become the type of enemy that sends others after you without confronting you themselves. Low fear but high respect in that case could mean that mob would still fight you, but perhaps would ask your consent instead of raping if the protag was defeated. They might even heal you up, giving you a 2nd chance instead of having to start from your base or getting captured or whatever. If you stab them in the back after they give you that 2nd chance, I could see the respect stat drop HUGELY assuming they leave you alone after that 2nd chance revival. See it opens up quite a few combos with the other stats.

    3. I think that would overlap too much with appeal and fear.
      If aggression is a thing, it would also have the same function, since entities would probably less aggressive if you're stronger than them.

      pretty much every other situation where respect would be raised, it would raise appeal. Only situation would be an honorable warrior raising respect when you beat them, but that seems like it would be better left to a trait, since most will become fearful. (25% fear would be about the same as respect)

    4. Oh that makes a lot of sense actually. I guess respect could simply be one of the more unique "traits" that mobs could get in the form of "Respectful" then or "Disrespectful" in the opposite regard. Those could be the ones that honour or dishonour a battle instead. I guess making respect its own ovelapping stat would complicate things far too much anyway

  8. What about the "Opinion" stat? For example, if one mob met another, and they have a rather high "Opinion", they'll likely be able to be around each other more, (This also counts for the player) if one mob as a high opinion of another, most likely above 50%, they cannot hurt or attack each other, and will help each other in fights. (Opinion is considered as "Frienship")

    If one of the two mobs with their high "Opinion" faints, the standing mob could knee down, to their fallen friend. This is where the player could help them out. If you do, then you pretty much make two friends (You can drag the fallen mob over to your shack and make him or her rest on your bed, but doing so, you will not be able to sleep for the night).

    Maybe this idea could be handy if you're looking for a "Mate" to have sex with? Yes. If the "Opinion" meter reaches a certain threshold,and you helped them out, then there's a slight chance that your new friend may develop feelings for you, which gives you an oppertunity to have sex, the easy way

    1. Thats pretty much what love/hate will be, with 50% being considered friendship.

  9. I think I have a stat: What about "Popularity"? Allow me to explain: When you first start off the game, fresh, you have simply no "Popularity", but as you explore the world, that stat increases. But Popularity is sort of.. Well, let's just say, it shifts the style of gameplay. For example, if you give gifts to the entities in your world, everytime you come across, they'll think you're friendly, and start to hang around you, this'll raise the "Popularity" meter a bit, and it turns blue. (They won't enter your home necessarily).

    If you rather rape and have sex with everyone you see, the Popularity increases too, but it'll have a red-pinkish color. This determines that everyone knows you to be a "Horny protagonist" and instead of hanging around you, they'll try to pin you down and fuck you.

    If you rather attack everyone you see in self defense or just to fight, the "Popularity" increases as a black color. This color determines the entities around you that you're quite hostile and rather avoid you, instead of being around you, though.. Some entities that have the "Appealing Fighting" trait, sometimes attacks you for a fight.

    If you stay neutral (No fucking, no attacking and no gifting entities) then the "Popularity" meter increases in a yellowish color, which determines you being neutral on everything.. Most of the entities will leave you alone, doing your business.

    If you have no "Popularity" at all, then everyone thinks you're a stranger. And you'll most likely have normal gameplay having either no "Popularity" and "Neutral Popularity"

    1. That would be a bit different since reputation in that way would be more of a global thing. Maybe it would be better to have titles that are on a per-area basis? aka you fuck a lot in an area and it gives you a title that gives you a modifier with all entities. But go to a different area, and it changes.

      For other entities, each might just have one title for everywhere. (since otherwise it would take a lot of memory.)

    2. Reputation per zone sems like a given, especially whith the villages and all coming up eventually. If each construction in a tile makes the adjacent tiles count as a reputation zone, villages borders may expend naturally.

      This can also tie into rivalry between villages/camps if a thresold of constructions inside a single tile makes its influence expand more. For exemple, the starting house have a radius of 1 on the map, while a group of 6 houses in the same tile gets a radius of 3 or a group of 20 constructions (house/field/shop/fountain/etc) may have a radius of 10.

      Therefore, a "capital city" full of constructions from one end of a level to the other would have a huge influance factor even if only covering just a few tiles at most. other influance zones within it's zone can choose to be allies (act like vassals) or ennemies (rebellion/invasion) so interesting inter-map movments and reputation dynamics may occur over time.

      The simplest way to check reputation and if a zone is free would be an "overlay" on the map you can switch to. With basic info like the average hostility of entities in the tile (danger level) and the ratio between creatures and intelegent beings (wile area/village). As for zone themselves, who control the zone (most represented specie / owner of the most constructions) and if they got allies/ennemies (other owners listed as one or the other)

      With those things you get clearly defined tiles and zones, and extended influence that may cover caves and other wild/instance biomes to create chain reactions over needs and influance gains.

    3. Yeah Kyrieru, if you think that's a better idea instead of every area you visit, then it's better to do that then, and yes, with "Popularity" it's actually meant as in your reputation, which shifts to what you do. (I'm not the same Anonymous as the one above me, I'm the one that suggested the "Popularity" stat)

      And, I forgot to mention, if there's a setting's menu, or a stat menu (I noticed a menu similar like that with like "Lust" and "Pleasure") maybe you could see in further detail what the entities in your current area thinks of you?

    4. You will be able to view relationship stats and stuff like that from a menu.

  10. how about something similar to fallout: new Vegas where you ha a reputation chart that logs all the good and bad things you do, for example. if you clear out a lot of monsters from the local village and help them all with quests then they begin to idolise you, (giving you free stuff, "offering" themselves to you). but if you do mostly bad things (steal, rape etc) then you become a villain to them. (guards attack you and villagers run away from you.) and a mix of both makes you a sort of merciful thug. i think it would be cool to see all the roll-playing you could do with this

  11. 11 may update ?

    1. Needed to program stuff to implement what I made so will be combined with next weekend. (in prev post)

      Keep forgetting to change sidebar.

  12. You've indicated that the player will be able to see how another entity feels about them (it looks like you've got some kind of pop-up box planned, and it sounds like you're going to make the entity itself emote somehow), but how are you going to make relationships between entities clear to the player, without "interference" from the player also being there when they interact?

    1. Well, main thing is you would see them interact. However you will probably be able to click on an entity and view their relationships. Traits would probably be ???, and then as relationship increases you would discover what they are.

  13. Why not 'hostility' to replace disgust.

  14. Malice is a good way to put it. Morality could be another. A character with low morality might try to rape anyone they come across, while a middling character might only do it if they have really high lust or if their target has a high appeal for them.

    A high morality character might almost never attempt to rape anyone.

    1. Morality would be an individual stat, rather than a relationship thing. Appeal, love, fearm etc is the unique relationship between two units.

    2. maybe there could be a sub stat that emerges once certain criterias have been fullfilled like Obsession (following their target with onesided affection) or Sadistic tendecies for examble a mob that has raped or beaten up someone again and again and thus growing their love and agression towards same target

  15. gronkus senior15 May 2020 at 14:48

    aggression/malice could be cool as it could add a lot of situations to the game.

    Things like monsters and bandits would have natural aggression and will attack you as soon as they see you. while more civilised creatures like towns people or slugs will just hang around places, interact with you and perhaps trade with you. though there could be some outliers like a peaceful orc that doesn't want to fight. or a slug that's pretty randy and likes to attack.

    This can be affected and changed however, for example if you harass a town enough (stealing, destroying property, etc). then the guards will attack you if you try to approach or if your particularly monstrous, then the townsfolk might try to hunt you down to imprison you. while the slugs will start defend themselves if you attack them too much. but on the other end, monsters will stop attacking you if you befriend them (offering them food, inviting them to fuck, defending their homes/nests) allowing you to visit them and perhaps even living with them.

    aggression could be a kind of short term thing, going up and down constantly depending on what you do around them. while malice could act as a long term version that influences aggression, high malice will give the character a naturally high aggression and vice versa. malice will increase if left with a high aggression for a while and lower if calmed down a lot.

    on a similar note, one idea for a stat could be corruption/lewdness. it acts similar to how it does in the game Lilith's throne, where it determines how lewd a character is.

    a high corruption stat will make characters more likely to do more lewd things, while a lower corruption stat will make them less lewd. this is unrelated to the character being good or evil, for example, a low corruption bandit will just rob you, while a high corruption villager might make advances on you or offer money. the player can be affected by this too as if the player has a high corruption, their lust goes up quicker and suffers debuffs if they haven't had sex or masturbated in a while. this can also be affected and changed, for example, an innocent village boy can be corrupted by fucking him silly, slowly becoming used to your advances and becoming more lewd (seeking you out, find him masturbating etc). as for curing corruption, perhaps there could be a church building in some towns that allows you to "clean your self of your sins" clearing you and your party members corruption.

  16. corruption? for the other stat

  17. I was wondering if you could make a version for mac computers? and if you cant is there any way I can make it playable on my Mac Mojave OS such as an outside proggram. i tried to use The wine loader program but it gave me an error that read something along the lines of

    "FATAL ERROR in Fragment Shader compliation ShaderName shd_pal_swapper_XP

    Pixel shader not compatible with this device
    at gml_Script_palXP_init
    stack frame is
    gml_Script-palXP_init (line -1)

    If anybody knows what that means and can help me I appreciate it a ton!